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Good day everyone

I've had the chance to see a Hang imitation by Luis Eguiguren the other day. Several things come to my mind:

1) That "Bell" by Luis (what a deceiving name, I couldn't see anything "bell-like" in this object) is a clear attempt to imitate the Hang by PANArt. The optical look, the brass ring, the BELLArt logo, the actual size, all this shows the clear intention of imitating the original Hang.

2) This imitation by Luis is made of thinner steel than the original Hang. It is widely known among pan tuners that working with thinner steel quickly leeds to "usable results". But since sizes of note fields and pitches are roughly the same like on the Hang, the conclusion is that the note geometry is by no means the same, hence the sound developement (strength, focus, clarity and so on) is a different one.

3) Because of the thin raw material, the sound of this Hang imitation is "thin" as well. For the lack of a more appropriate word, I call it a "cheap sound".

4) Due to the architectural weekness, there is no clear and strong helmholtz resonance to be found. Also, due to the thin steel, the tones distort very quickly. Giving just a little bit too much force on a note field, the result becomes disagreable - even ugly - very quick.

5) The workmanship is world class! Absolutely no hammer marks whatsoever. The object looks like "licked" (geschleckt). I have a hard time imagining that a person "coming out of nowhere" is able to achieve this result in such a short time. The "learning curve" is unbelievable! And that is precisely my point of view at the moment: I don't believe...

Furthermore, there is something else that raises my serious doubts about Luis Eguiguren as a tuner of steel:

6)Each and every tuner of steel is oh-so-proud of his work! A tuner would not hesitate to tell each and everyone about his work. He would proudly make sure that everybody knows that an' instrument was made and tuned by him. He would show his customers how he is putting the notes into vibration. He would take pride and personally sign his creations, for they are his children, so to speak. But the Hang imitations by Luis appear to be nameless objects. That is something very odd to me, to say the least...

Where do we go from here?
The "Bells" by Luis Eguiguren are a poor imitation of the PANArt Hang. I deliberately do not call them copies, as this would imply a one-to-one copy of the original. The "Bells" are not a copy of the Hang, they are just a "Hang-look-alike"...
Fair enough, one may argue. I'd reply that, if the Hang is the original wooden concert piano, the "Bells" are like those cheap plastic pianos from some far eastern big company.
What is then irritating is, that the imitations by Luis are being sold for roughly the same prize as PANArt are selling their present creations. Hence: What a scam!

On a side note: I have been observing that the "Bells" (as well as the Halo's) are now popping up on ebay, for ridiculous prizes I might add.
If I imagine my steelpans being sold for three times the original prize (or even more), I'd be really annoyed (I'd prefer to use a much harsher word than "annoyed", but you get my point...)!
I therefore do understand the concept of PANArt and their "droit de suite", and I wholehartedly agree with them!

While the "Halo", the "Bali Handpan", the "Spacedrum", the "tongue drums" clearly differ from the original Hang concerning looks, tone, size, and (in most cases) prize, the imitations by Luis are "pretending to be original creations".

This fact will screw Luis, no doubt, both humanly and legally...

We presently do not live in a "world of plenty" where "energy and resources are cheap". The Hang (and, as far as I see it, the steelpan) is a good tool to bring us to conciousness about this fact. "Slowing down and thinking" may be a generally valid motto in these present days.

My advice would be: Before you commit yourself financially and emotionally to ANYTHING, check it out first. Most importantly, COMPARE, personally that is.
If there is no possibility to do so, rather refrain from buying and consuming anything, but enjoy the happyness that comes from simply enjoying and listening, even if that means to enjoy youtube clips of inferior quality.

The story and happenings around Luis Eguiguren and his Hang imitation are to be followed. I'd not be amazed if it will make for some good entertainment and laughter. For those who did not put their hopes and money in, that is...

Greetings
Werner

Werner thank you very much for your review about the BELLS. I was on the list of BELL for about a year, but a I tested an aeolian scale made by Luis in person + an aeolian first generation hang hang by PANART and I just can say what you say here, looks like a poor imitation. I assume that the efforts from Luis would be for good in the future but, seems like the conclusion is "Hang is unique" and just Felix and Sabina have the knowledge and the final decision to teach some day their secret about the hang magical sound. I notified Luis that I will not purchase a bell from him...I waited until now about 2 years for a hang, I don't know if I will able to have one someday in my life but I'm sure that I don't want any poor copy in my hands. Last year I understood lot of things that I criticized and going against to PANART everyday in my mind. But after a deep research I understood why the HANG it's the HANG even if there's so many questions that I have and I want to discuss with the hangmakers if I will have the opportunity to do it.

Sorry for my poor english level :-(

Thank you again Werner, I'm agree with you.

Massimiliano

I totally agree... I think what you have written hits the nail on the head quite nicely Werner.

Thanks

I totally disagree with you three. Felix and Sabina CREATED a new world, They are GOD-LIKE. But since the demands of Hanghang are overwhelming. They couldn't create Hanghang for everyone. The hope of thousands of people whom eagerly want to get their own Hanghang are sentence to death. It's not a right or wrong thing. "If there is no possibility to do so, rather refrain from buying and consuming anything, but enjoy the happyness that comes from simply enjoying and listening" It's just a personal advice right? People have their rights to choose. And I'm sure that Hanghang's life more than centuries. Obviously longer than one person's life. And Felix and Sabina create Hanghang by rich experience.(Even Felix's Hanghangs have different characters compare with Sabina's Hanghangs) Experiences are the hardest thing to impart. So the question comes----Can the Felix and Sabina's inheritor(sorry for my poor English, I have to find the words similar) make the Hanghang exactly?( I mean the same as Felix and Sabina's works.) If their creatures's quality are not as good as F&S's . Do they have to change their creatures' name?

Hang is not one instrument but a species of harmonic resonance sound container. I agree that there is no imitations(handpan tongue drum .etc) can compare with Hanghang for now. So the name of "Hanghang" Only for PanArt. But if Some imitator(Not by bad meaning at all) get a great improvement, their creatures's can be Hang. Otherwise the Hang will gone with Felix and Sabina.(Sorry to say that, you know I don't give offence to them).

I think Luis's work is respectable. And I do believe that Luis will create a Hang very soon. And more and more imitators will appear. Hang just like a baby, parents and other people can help him grow, but never dominate his life.

@Trans, No one said Luis couldn't and shouldn't do what he is with creating a handpan but I’m afraid it will never be a Hang by name, that is a name owned by PANart and yes, once they are gone the name will become sought after, it already is.

The issue is and always will be at this stage with the BELL is the name is written on the instrument in the same way as PANart BELLart, the look is the same with the brass ring and should Luis really be charging 1200 euro's for something that as you have said is not yet a Hang anyway??

There is nothing GOD like about PANart they are two mere mortal people who have come together to create what is a wonderful piece of music/art, yes they have made some mistakes along the way in my opinion, but its their business and no one can dictate to them what or how they run it.

People need to accept it even if they don't understand it.

Luis is not as experienced as PANart, so the choice is this, do PANart increase the cost of a Hang? after all people pay for quality. I'm not saying that the BELL is not a quality instrument in its own right (although as a steel pan maker/tuner Werner has some valid points above), but why is it commanding a price the same as a Hang?

I think Werener, although blunt is too the point and he makes some excellent comments regarding the BELL, comments that have been echoed over at Handpan for a long time.

No one is saying that there should not be other makers in this world creating Hang-esque instruments… we all know that PANart cannot meet the demands of the world and variety is the spice of life, but at what cost? Obviously its up to Luis what price he sells his instruments at and people who cannot get a Hang/have been refused a Hang will obviously gravitate towards the other Handpans which is great, even those who have a Hang have bought them, hell I like the sound of the Halo and the world needs Caisa, Halo, BELLs and Hapi drums.

As far as workmanship goes, yes every Hang may sound different, especially with the new FIH I think that’s part of the plan but the quality is there. Luis has a way to go just yet and the price should reflect that in my honest opinion.

Its not a personal attack on Luis, I’ve heard he is a lovely guy and I applaud his efforts. I recently also had the chance to play a BELL in person and it’s a lovely sounding instrument… but its not got the quality in tone of a Hang, that’s a fact. It also looks just like a Hang, made even more apparent by the brass ring and the logo…. What would you do if someone made a direct imitation of your work and sold it for the same price? Be happy or be ever so slightly narked that they’ve copied it.

Its always going to be a talking point, and we’ll also not always agree. The above is just my opinion on the matter, we’re all entitled to that

Hallo,

thank you Werner for your words. I am just back from Panart and I speak a long time with Felix and Sabina about the physics of the Hang and the strong distinctions between Hang and Bell.
Panart know what the Bell is and how it works. (Only for the people who think that we only speak about the Bells on the basis of Youtube videos)
I played the Bells in real, and I could speak as an Hangplayer who play the Hang for a lot of years daily.

1. The Bell is in tune. No question. All notes have a fundamental and overtones. You could play melodies on it. No problem.

2. You have only 8 notes and after a short while the playing is totally boring.
What should I do with 8 notes as an musician? Yes, the sound is on the first moment pleasant for the ears. The problem is the dynamic. There is no dynamic in the Bells.
The notes ring alone.
You could touch a Hang and the answer comes from the whole Hang. On the Bells the answer is coming from the tone you have touched.

3. Think about what Werner said about the thickness of the metall. The Bell has the same size as the Hang but it is significant lightweight.
Because the metall on the Hang is thicker and stronger.
The metall sheet from Lluis is round about 0,8 mm.
The most good steelpans are build from thicker metall sheet as this 0,8 mm.
Steelpans with such a thin material are not very good.
Do you think a Hang is less good in quality as a steelpan and there such a thin material is fine?
So, the material from Bells is so light and thin, because it is much easyer for the people behind Bellart to build something what looks exact like the Hang, with a "pleasant" sound.
A little bit more thin and you have the metall sheet used for a tin can.

The Bell is a little bit like these Rolex watches forgeries. They look from outside like a Rolex but there is nothing inside.
The difference is, that these forgeries are very cheap in relation to the original.
To sell the Bell for the same price as the Hang is "piss take" and I think it is also an insult for the Hangmakers work.

Felix and Sabina from Panart work with a strong material. It is a hard work with the hammer and it needs a lot of experience.
Felix said to me that there is no problem for an steelpan tuner with a little bit experience, to build a lot of Hang forgeries in Bell quality.

Yes, I say "forgeries" and not "copys". The Bell looks exact like a first generation Hang with a brassring.
The name "BellArt" (first ist was Hanart) , and everything else is not inspired by the Hang it is a forgery.

As Werner said. Any steelpan tuner is proud of his work. They sign the result with their name.
Where is the name from the maker on the Bells? Is he not proud? Or is there another problem? It is realy only Lluis who make the bells? Only one tuner?

If you want to play the Bell like a Hang it doesnt work. You dont find the rich sound in these instrument.
If you need a so called "Handpan", you dont find it if you buy a Bell. This instrument dont sound like a Pan.
If you need 8 notes to play it is cheaper to buy a xylophone. There is also a linear system of notes, as on the Bells. And you have not only 8 notes.
The Hang is not linear.

The "piss take" to sell the Bell for so much money to people dont will work for a long time. This is for sure.

I have a lot of more thoughts and in the next days I will write with more time and better englisch (I hope so).

It is good that a discussion about "quality" , begin. The world is full of such "low level" things.

Greetings
Frank

@Kelly, Thanks for reply. I understand you points. And agree almost.

1) I think BElls' price is fair. I also notice that even you think the BElls is overprice, due to it's "cheap sound". People is willing to offer BElls. As far as I know there are more than 1000 people on the BElls waiting list(include me I'm 696). Are They all creaze? I don't think so. Lots of people whom buy BElls or Caisa or Halo Not to instead of Hanghang. Hanghang and other imitations have different colours(风格).(I start to regret for skiping English classes in school)The BElls owners are surprise by the amazing sound so far as I know(on forum). I do think if Luis sells BElls on Ebay will get twice price at least.

I admire Felix and Sabina for such a fair price, obviously they never sell Hanghang for profit. And Luis is also fair enough. People think BElls overprice, but more people think it fair.

If I were Luis, I'll make the BElls' price at 1199 euro's for taking my hat off to Felix and Sabina.

I don't like Werner's opinion. He write down what he thought(very personal and subjective) to prove BElls is a imitation loser. back to his opinion "The optical look, the brass ring, the BELLArt logo, the actual size " So what? F&S have a astounding research about resonance and appearance. Why shouldn't Luis "imitate" Hanghang If that don't break the law? Does Hanghang belongs to F&S or the whole human being? Free for what?

Originators are the window of heaven, lighten us by hope, Imitators are Babel builders, they make us to be close to Heaven.

Everyone said Werner is a great tuner. So what? I think his opinions a little bit hysterically.

Guys I tested three (3) Bells here in Barcelona. What Funky says is totally truth the tones itself are OK but the all notes combined and the all sound "Specially if you play really soft or with speed like Manu Delago, Dante Bucci, or Ravid" reveal the fact about the balance of the instrument is not good. As I said I was in the Bells list, like many other just because I believed that would be impossible to get a hang in this life. But because there's nothing out there that captivate me in 100% at the moment I will not invest 600 € in a Spacedrum or 1.400 in a 8 notes BELL if I'm not comfortable with the music aspects and sound.

On the other hand I understood lot of things that I criticized about how the Panart works. But there's nothing to do. I decided to own a hang if the hangmakers bring me the opportunity to have one some day, if that opportunity never arrived "NOT A PROBLEM" I would not flame Panart anymore because is wasting time. I'm now assuming a new role about to stay calm, keep in mind the hang sound without obsession, and just wait for the miracle to get one... in the meantime I always meet with people like Ravid to talk about the hang and play with it.

Peace for all!.

P.D: Funky I sent you some PM during August, did you got those messages? Thanks

@funky, You make the fair remark about Bells and Hanghang. I admire your work. Sure Bells couldn’t compare to Hanghang, but he is not only forging Bells to Sell right? He work hard to get improve on his tuner skill. Though a long way to go. Appearance is easy to forge, but the sound is by himself right? He try his best to imitate the rich resonance of Hanghang, if there are other tuners helping him, So what? Just ”They try their best to imitate the rich resonance of Hanghang” He or they is/are forerunner/forerunners.

Didn’t have good quality, It’s OK.“不怕慢就怕站”(Don’t afraid of Slow, Never stop),I’d glad to see his improvement, There are lots of Hangplayers and tuners and experts on this forum, Why don’t you encourage the imitators instead of being hostile to them.

Do I think people are crazy for being on the BELLart list... no, not at all. I think people are on there because they have no choice but to be on the list.

A friend of mine recently bought a BELL, he has a Hang also but loves the upbeat feel of some of the first Gen sounds, is there a chance for him to buy a Hang first Gen in F? nope.... PANart won't make them anymore which is their decision... personally i love the variety but also understand the development of the sound and the body of the Hang is where it is today.

So what choice does he have if he can't get a Hang? I think the BELL he has is lovely, nothing wrong with it apart from the price, a first GEN hang used to sell for £200 - £400 but you still get the crisp resonance of the notes even at that price, that is missing from the BELL so in my opinion and probably many others I think it is overpriced... but equally as you say there are people that think it isn't, because its an option and an opinion.

It’s going to be one of those constant arguments in that there isn't actually an argument to be had, just a matter of opinion, those who are pro and those who are not.

Its all down to a matter of opinion, to buy a top of the range Skoda Octavia Estate for £23,000, a top of the range VW Passat Estate for £32,000 or the Audi A6 estate for £44,000…. They’re all essentially the same car, same features, same engines, different badges and build quality! Would you pay £44k for a Skoda, only if there was no choice I suppose….

Just an analogy but this is how I see it, there has to be a difference in price to distinguish quality but each to their own.

be cool guys... its all opinion (and copyright theft LOL)

Hallo,

@Trans. Have you played a Bell in real? Have you played a Hang in real?

Let us speak about the qualitys. It is very interesting.

Imagine that there is no Panart Hang and only the Bell. Do you think that people will pay so much money for such a quality?

In the next days we can speak about all the details in quality. Point by point.
You will see, that the Bell is realy a Scam.

It is a "good made" scam. This is for sure. Felix said to me, that he himself must do a double take if he see a Bell. It looks in the first moment like a first generation Hang with Brass ring. A lot of first generation Hang have these Brassring, because people want it.
I say "see". If you touch or hear the Bell you find out easy the real quality.

Frank

Hi,

NO he dont. He use a thin powerless metall sheet to avoiding all the problems he would have with a material what could work.
He dont must deal with all the friction and strains. The Bell is "dead".
It is relative easy to tune a tone field like Lluis (or maybe his tuners) do that.
To tune the notes is a question of the geometry. If you want dynamic you must use first a thicker metall sheet. And than then you could start to learn.....

Frank

Werner wrote that the Bells is an imitation of a Hang and I think that this attribution is correct. Or as Sabina Schärer expressed it when we talked together in a little restaurant in Bern a few days ago: “Außen fix – Innen nix!” (English translation is difficult, perhaps: “Proper outside – Nothing inside”)

A long time I abstained from discussing the Bells in detail because I didn’t had enough information – only from internet, YoutTube etc. Now the time has come for a serious discussion on quality because I got enough personal experience and information. Several weeks ago I had the opportunity to play and check out a bells personally at my home for a whole weekend. Two weeks ago I received a detailed report by Felix Rohner about an examination of a Bells including a number of scientific measurements. And a few day ago when we met at the Hangbauhaus Felix Rohner could explain me some aspects personally and practically at a Bells they have for examination.

So let’s talk about the quality of the Bells and why it is an imitation and not a (try of a) copy (I wrote this text before I had the opportunity to read Funky's post so there are some overlaps, but I think it doesn't matter):

What is a copy?
If you copy something you try to create the same appearance as well as the the same function, physical and technical properties. In the best case you get the same thing as the original. If you copy the Hang you will get a reasonable, quality instrument. Only the legal issues will have to be discussed.

What is an imitation?
If you imitate something, you want get something that looks like the original. But you don’t care for function, physical and technical properties. The best known example for imitations are the Chinese watches looking like Rolex but have not the technique of a Rolex inside. The target of an imitator is to benefit from the high price of the original in order to achieve as much profit as possible with as little effort as possible.

So why is the Bells an imitation?

a) While the Bells has nearly the same shape and size like a Hang it weights 750g less than a Hang. The reason for this is the thinner sheet steel used for the Bells. The underside has 0.75mm and the upper side has 0.88mm. Steel pans are build from a material with 1.0mm to 1.2mm thickness. There is an important reason why tuners don’t use such thin material as it is used for the Bells: A main aspect for the quality of the sound is the bending stiffness of the material. This parameter is influenced by the thickness in cube. Therefor the bending stiffness lowers a lot if you lower the thickness only a bit. Here we can see an aspect of the imitation philosophy of the Bells makers: It is challenging to tune nitrided steel with 1.0mm thickness. So don’t care! Make the sheet steel thinner! You will need less effort, less time to produce something that sounds with the correct frequencies.

b) The main reason for the quality of the Hang sound is the fact that this instrument is made and tuned with high inner tensions. These inner tensions are responsible for the potential energy inside the instrument. It is a bit similar to a string: If you stretch a string enough you get enough potential energy into the oscillating system to get a strong sound out of the string instrument. If you stretch the string only a bit the sound will become week and dull. At sheet steel instruments the tensions have the same function: They serve the sounds with potential energy. But there is a main difference to the string: The tension is not responsible for the frequency of the sound. The frequency of a sounding plate is influenced by geometrical dimensions and some other edge conditions. The art of Hang making and Hang tuning is to deal with the tensions in the shell (to get the correct frequencies is only the last step). In opposite to this the Bells has no appreciable tensions. If you compare the tone field of the Bells you will see that they try to look like the tone fields of a Hang. But they are flat and not concave (but the concave form is one of several aspects necessary to bring tension into the tone field). The tone fields of the Bells are just isolated plates that rings according to their geometrical dimensions. Therefor the sound of the Bells is week and dull. The topic tension is another aspect showing us the imitation philosophy of the Bells makers: For example the diagonal orientation of the tone fields of the Bells. At the Hang this orientation have an important function relating to a class of tensions in the shell. But these tensions are not realised in the Bells. So the diagonal orientation of the Bells' tone fields hasn't any function. It only exists in order to get the same appearance as the Hang. For example the blue-green colour of the Bell: It is the result of an heating process at a temperature of 250°C to 280°C. This heating is made after tuning, because the oxidation layer, that creates the colour is very thin and we would see tuning marks if there was used a hammer after this procedure. If you had brought tensions into the Bells shell during the tuning process, you destroy them with such a high temperature. So we can see that the Bells makers don’t care about tensions, but they want to get a similar colour as the Hang, so they heat it after tuning.

c) Another main aspect of the quality of Hang sound is the high recoupling potential of the Hang. Recoupling means that oscillating modes in the tone fields of the Hang send waves over the whole shell and can excite other modes in other tone fields. Because of the week material and the missing tensions, we have no audible recoupling effects at the Bells. The tone fields are isolated. That makes the the Bells linear. Although it looks like a Hang, it is just a number of tones ordered in zick zack from low to high. A very little number of tones! And this is a big problem for a linear instrument: It becomes quite boring and the player will call for more tones and more scales. We have all this in other nice linear instruments: Play the chromatic Vibraphone or Xylophone! Play the steel pan! Why do you need an instrument layout like the Hang with its strong limitations in the number of tones? The richness of the Hang is its non linear character: The vessel sounds as a whole in every moment and the single sounds are embedded in a complex structure of interpedendencies. This is the reason why Hang playing is not boring although it has such a limited number of tones. Here we see the philosophy of imitation again: If the Bells look like a Hang you will get more profit. So why to care about the non linear instrument concept of the Hang?

These are three examples of aspects that make the Bells a Hang imitation. It exploits the desire of humans touched by the sound of the Hang in order to make profit. There isn’t any serious examination of the practical and theoretical basics of Hang making and Hang tuning. The Bells makers don’t care about the main physical requirements for the Hang sound. It’s just a commercial project to benefit from all the Hang seekers in the world.

Ix


P. S. There is one correction of Werner’s post necessary: There is a Helmholtz-resonance in the Bells. That’s not astonishing because the bells makers copied the shape of the Hang. The Helmholtz-resonance is simple physics. The main aspect is, that the rich interplay of recoupling effects of the circle, the Ding and the Gu is missing at the Bells. Only the central Dome and the Helmholtz-resonance work together. The tone fields in the circle stand isolated aside.

Hi Funky

I'm Sorry for my poor and slow English expression. A lot of my thoughts vanish, because I couldn't find proper words.

I have connect with Hang 1 year ago(cause the GFW'Great Fire Wall in china') on a video website in China. So I wish I have play Hang. Now I'm on the BElls waiting list 696(far far away, maybe then Luis will get more better qualitys) So I wish I have play BElls.

I have no right to compare Hang and BElls. But according to the vids on youtube, I can feel the difference between Hang & BElls, Hang is like a live instrument, people don't PLAY it, they awake it, Hang'll active by its own, people always just to lead Hang.
The BElls is more passive. Lack of lucidity, a little foggy.

As I said Hanghang should be price more than 3000€, By any reason. So BElls surely worth 1300€.

We're very very interesting in listen to your experiences about Hang and BElls. I love all you guys working for Hang's Improvement, you are all heros. Especially Funky Werner IX , but I don't like Werner's opinions and attitude to imitators

I have a strong presentiment that this topic(and The whole context ,I couldn't find the word-帖子) will be a landmark. From blablablabla to serious discussions.

"The Bell is "dead"" That's what I thought, but I don't go straight.

Now I know the impotance of thickness. I also thought the Bali steelpan, seems more thinner. crisp sound , a little stridence

@Ix, WOW

I only can say is WOW

You enlighten the most of us. Very very fabulous. You have explained a lot questions hovering(Bad English)in my mind.

WOW

Hey IX nice post man, lot of helpful information.



Massimiliano

When you all say that the Bells is the same price as a hang you are not taking into account the fact that people have to travel to Berne to actually receive one.
For many people the cost of the airfares to get where they have to get far out weighs the price of the thing you getting!
So for me I can buy 2 bells for the price of one hang which means that for me it's half the price

Massimiliano I think you are greasing
I liked you better when you showed some balls!

frazz

Good day everyone!

@Ixkeys:
I was not aware of a clear and strong helmholtz resonance in the 3 imitations of Luis which a had the chance to try. That's why I said, there is none. It would also seem to me (logically) that there is a helmholtz resonance, since the dimensions are the same. But my feeling was that the resonance couldn't be activated like on a Hang, therefore I said "there is none". My bad.

@trans, I quote you:

Who says so? When? Where? And no, I am not histerical at all, I am just blunt and straight forward. Call me unpolite if you wish. And by the way: Who are YOU?


I write down what I think and as I see it. Like everyone else. Like it or not, that's up to you.


I am not a hero. Maybe Frank and Ixkeys are... Furthermore, for me this is not about "who likes what attitude" and stuff like that. For me, it is, as you yourself did put it, the chance to go from "blablablabla to serious discussions".

I therefore suggest that we stick to facts, and not hearsay. The point that x-amount of people are on whatever list doesn't prove anything. The point that there are players which love their Hang imitations and find them of "superior quality" doesn't prove anything. Finally, youtube clips do not prove anything either...

I am not "against" imitators. I am not stupid and I see how life and the world works. And exactly BECAUSE there is such a hype and a "horray-horray" about the imitations of Luis, it seems important to me to speak up and share my experience. Not everything that shines is gold you know...

Greetings
Werner

Hallo,

@Trans. If I understand you correct you heard the Hang and the Bell only on Youtube. Yes, this is one reason why Lluis could sell his Bells for so much money.
You could hear only your PC loudspeaker. If you touch the Hang or the Bells the difference ist not little. There are worlds between these "instruments."
Not in the first moment. The sound from the Bell is not unpleasant for the ears. What you have are 8 tuned tone fields. Totally boring after a short time. A thin and cheap sound.
There is no dynamic in the Bell. There is no tension.
You can make an easy experiment. Put a Hang in direct sunlight. The Hang will go out of tune after a short while, but the tuning comes back if you go in the shadow and wait a few minutes.
Put the Bell in direct sunlight and the Bell will not! go out of tune in the same way.
The Bell is only "flabby" without the important equilibrium of stresses.

Lluis (or the people behind Bellart) avoid all problems with his thin metall sheets.

It is time to stop with "spiel talkings". We speak about physical facts.
We speak about quality.

Greetings
Frank